Subject: Hockey
Date: Wed Jun 3 16:07:23 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:It left a bad taste in our mouths last year, seeing Detroit parade the Cup around Pittsburgh ice. I hope whoever wins the series does so in front of their own fans.
(For the fans' sakes as well.)
Date: Thu Jun 4 09:10:08 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:Mike posted: "Well ya know, a sweep was never in the cards :-) Funniest thing about the game was that the Penguins had too many men on the ice for 21 seconds and none of the officiating crew noticed. It'll take that gang a while to live that down!"
Yeah. I know. Like when the Wings had two goal tenders in both home games. It should have been an easy goal for Crosby on his own rebound. (A penalty shot should have been awarded to the Pens in at least game 1 for that infraction.) Link below.
For too many on the ice, you get a power play. For the goal infraction in the paint, you get a penalty shot. Penalty shots typically have a much higher success rate than power plays, an it would have been Crosby coming down the pipe with no obstruction.
Then in Game 2 Zetterberg (the same guy) fell onto the puck, covering it with his body in the crease, another penalty shot. Heads-up plays on his part, but not the officials:
"No defending player, except the goalkeeper, will be permitted to fall on the puck, hold the puck, pick up the puck, or gather the puck into the body or hands when the puck is within the goal crease. For infringement of this rule, play shall immediately be stopped and a penalty shot shall be ordered against the offending team, but no other penalty shall be given. The rule shall be interpreted so that a penalty shot will be awarded only when the puck is in the crease at the instant the offense occurs. However, in cases where the puck is outside the crease, Rule 63 may still apply and a minor penalty may be imposed, even though no penalty shot is awarded. The significant factor when determining whether or not a penalty shot is warranted is the location of the puck at the time it was held, grabbed or gathered into the body. If the puck is in the crease, penalty shot. If the puck is outside the crease and gathered into the body of a player (other than the goalkeeper) who is inside the crease, minor penalty)."
(Think another goal in each game might have changed the flow and the outcome of at least one?)
Oh well, I guess the breaks even out. I sure hope they do!
Link: A really "handy" skater
Date: Thu Jun 4 09:13:58 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:The thought of a penalty shot made me ponder. With Crosby coming at you mano-a-mano, what do you do? Come out to cut down the angle (possibly opening the back door, after a couple deeks, or do you hang back, trying to cover as much goalmouth as possible, but giving Crosby the angles?
Date: Thu Jun 4 10:30:23 2009
User: GoodOlMike
Message:Malkin had what amounted to a penalty shot in the first or second game and didn't score. Penalty shots aren't a sure thing. For the Red Wings, Samuelson had a little less open chance and hit the post.
The goalie has to wait for the shooter to get close enough before he can move out and try to block as much of the goal as possible. If the shooter tries for a bit too much sleight of hand, he gets too close to the goalie and has little chance of scoring. In the end, I think it takes a really well aimed shot to score.
There have been an unusual number of no-calls in this series. I guess I'd rather have that than too many calls, as long as the calls are fairly even.
Zetterberg's play is smart hockey. Hide the puck and get a whistle. He doesn't hold the puck.
Date: Thu Jun 4 11:20:37 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:They were both smart plays on the part of Zetterberg. Especialy the one where he illegally covered the puck with his gloved hand. The refs were away from the play and by the time they got there it was a scrum too complicated to sort out. Smart hockey.
But I do agree about the no "ticky-tack" calls. The refs are letting the players play hockey.
Re Malkin's breakaway? He was closely pursued by a Red Wing with a long hockey stick. He really couldn't make any moves. Give Crosby or Malkin an unobstructed path to the goal and all the time and moves necessary, with the other players standing off the playing surface and that's a different matter.
They likely score. On two penalty shots, they are getting at least one goal. Maybe two.
Date: Thu Jun 4 11:51:03 2009
User: GoodOlMike
Message:You forget that Malkin tripped a Red Wing to get the breakaway :-) It didn't matter much since he didn't score but there would have been plenty of howling if he had.
Date: Thu Jun 4 13:17:13 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:Could be true. I'd have to have another look. But that doesn't change the fact that a contested breakaway isn't the same as an unobstructed penalhy shot.
Go..... PENS!
But I'll still congratulate you if it doesn't work out our way.
(I'll hate you, but I'll still congratulate you!)
;)
Date: Thu Jun 4 14:34:54 2009
User: GoodOlMike
Message:Still no definitive word on whether Datsyuk will be playing tonight. If he's back and closer to 100% than 50%, there'll be some line changes on both sides. The man is a magician with the puck and very good on defense.
Date: Thu Jun 4 14:40:34 2009
User: firenze
Message:Are they still playing hockey? Isn't it June?
Date: Thu Jun 4 15:16:59 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:That's all we need now. A healthy Datsyuk. As it is, the Wings defensive zone resembles a stone wall when you try to carry the puck in. All you have are red jerseys swarming.
Date: Thu Jun 4 15:37:49 2009
User: GoodOlMike
Message:Well there aren't many people left playing hockey, but the ones that still are playing are happy :-)
Date: Thu Jun 4 16:11:32 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:And their fans are delirious! :-)
Date: Thu Jun 4 22:07:28 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:Pens lead 4-2 second intermission! Crosby breaks his goal-scoring drought!
Date: Fri Jun 5 07:58:09 2009
User: GoodOlMike
Message:Somebody must have been passing around stupid pills on the Wings bench during the second period. A team that's usually so good about being in position suddenly couldn't get out of its own way. They even battled each other for the puck twice during the period.
Oh well. Now it's a three game series with the Penguins holding some of the mighty mo.
Date: Fri Jun 5 09:18:22 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:One thing I noticed during most of the series, even the two games in Pittsburgh, was that the Wings seem to have consistently crisper passes and seem more attuned to the positioning of their teammates. They do drop-passes and cross-ice passes, and usually a teammate is right there to accept it.
But I was glad last night to see the Pens being more aggressive at getting their stick on a puck in a Red Wings's possession, and also breaking up passes. They had been laying back oo much, playing defensively. (For example that one-on-three Red Wing goal the other night!)
Another thing now is they are getting guys positioned to screen Osgood which helps a shot to get through. (What I complained about the other day.) Not so much that Helm was doing it consistently, but that the Pens were doing nothing to combat it, or even to duplicate it.
By the way, I saw "Sudden Death" the other night. (Jean-Claude Van Damme movie about American terrorists in the Pittsburgh Civic Arena (the Mellon Arena- Pittsburgh's "Igloo") with evil intent. As a Pittsburgh Fireman he eventually dispatches them. The special effects were amazing for its day, especially the helicopter crashing down onto the ice surface through the opened roof; Destruction everywhere! I have not been able to find out how the effects were done.
Date: Fri Jun 5 09:21:00 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:The movie takes place during Game Seven of the Stanley Cup Final. The game goes into Overtime (Sudden Death) which delays the terrorists'plan to blow up the building at the end of the game.
Date: Sat Jun 6 07:34:37 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:Hey, Mike. I just happened across a column by Tony Augusty. The guy's a total hoot! (I especially liked the one about Canadian and American percentages, and The Kazakhstan one was great too.) The guy also did hours of research on both teams competing tonight and arrived at the most rational, possible conclusion.
Link: Tony Augusty. I love this guy
Date: Sat Jun 6 08:22:01 2009
User: GoodOlMike
Message:Knowing you're a homer is important to knowing you shouldn't bet on the games :-)
Date: Sat Jun 6 20:59:45 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:1-0 Red Wings first intermission. I don't like how the Wings are carrying the puck into the Pens defensive zone, and often the first guy in gets off a shot. The Pens are challenged when they have the puck, so they dump it in. I hope they can correct that later.
But Red Wings start off with most of a two-minute power play.
Date: Sat Jun 6 22:07:36 2009
User: Somali-wants-a-cracker
Message:In the second period of the crucial fifth game, Pittsburgh was thoroughly humiliated as the Red Wings extended a 1-0 lead into 5-0 going into the final period. An injured Pavel Datsyuk, Detroit's best player this season, saw his first action of the series and sparked much of the inspired Wing play. During the closing minutes of the second period, Pittsburgh was reduced to a collection of chicken-shit cheap-shot artists as its players continually tried to knock Datsyuk and Henrick Zettenberg, Detroit's second-best player this year, out of play. Let's see if the Wings counter by suiting up Darren McCarty next game. Pretty-boy Crosby, who had a nice cheap shot of his own on Zettenberg, better watch out if this happens.
Date: Sat Jun 6 23:40:59 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:I think that's over-stating it. The guys were frustrated. Hopefully they will be back in form in Game 6.
Date: Sun Jun 7 08:26:50 2009
User: GoodOlMike
Message:The Wings pretty much laid the smack on the Penguins in game 5. Datsyuk wasn't in full stride but he sure made a difference. The Penguins looked like the Blackhawks in game 4, taking a lot of stupid penalties.
So now the mo has changed again.
Date: Sun Jun 7 08:35:06 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:It sure has. The guys were way disorganized and took stupid penalties, trying to make things happen. And it just got worse. Hopefully, Game 6 will be a good match. Last night's was not the kind of match the League was depending on. And hopefully Fleury will be back in form.
Date: Sun Jun 7 09:36:44 2009
User: LumberJack
Message:It was fantastic! Great centering passes, each team trying to control the flow of the game to their favor. Players throwing their bodies in front of the net to prevent goals. Those on offensive similarly having no regard for their safety. A couple of questionable penalty calls, but that's typical.
And the flashy plays! The blind heel pass that led to a opportunity on a nearly open net. The diving header with contact made at nearly ground level. Over 55,000 wild fans in Soldier Field.
In the end, it was 2-1 US over Honduras. What a game. The US is now in great position to advance.
Date: Sun Jun 7 13:07:34 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:Back to Hockey, I think the Red Wings may have been offended and came out with fire in their eyes. The media analysts have been concluding they are "older" and getting "weary" and might not be able to keep up with the young Pens. To make it worse, somebody asked Brooks Orpik about the idea and he said something like yeah, that could be right.
Now, we know Detroit has a really focused, experienced team and they need no motivation. But you gotta believe that found its way onto a prominet place in their locker room. When the Pens couldn't finish off that first power play (no shots on goal) that really brought it on for the Red Wings. And they played with fire in their eyes the whole way, causing the Pens to lose their composure. The Pens'passes weren't sharp, they mis-handled pucks, all the stuff a team in disarray does. And then, in trying to "hit" (the series has been one of hard hitting) they took penalties. And then they couldn't stop the renewed Detroit power play.
Perhaps, had the Pens been able to score on that first power play, the message might have been "Pens power play continues strong" instead of "Detroit penalty killing is strong and they might dominate." But the Pens didn't score, or even get a decent shot on goal in that first opportunity. And it all went downhill from there.
Perhaps now the message will be "the Pens are in over their heads" and they will be the ones with something to prove, while Detroit is feeling over-confident. I can only hope!
Date: Tue Jun 9 14:56:08 2009
User: GoodOlMike
Message:All fired up here :-) Can the Wings break the home ice advantage and win the Cup tonight? Five hours till game time!
Date: Tue Jun 9 16:15:00 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:I'm dyin' here!
We all believe the Pens can win tonight. We think they can get that mess the other night behind them and concentrate on Team hockey again instead of this individual stuff. If the Wings then win game 7, at least they will parade the Cup in front of their own fans.
Two cities would prefer that.
Date: Tue Jun 9 16:18:18 2009
User: GoodOlMike
Message:Actually, I'd like to see the Wings win it tonight :-)
Date: Tue Jun 9 18:29:50 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:I have to say that Detroit and Pittsburgh have some of the most passionate and knowledgeable fans in the league. (Or so it seems to me.) In some of the newer markets like Carolina for one, they are just getting the hang of it and Hockey for many is still an event down there, instead of a passion.
One example is that, when Detroit won the Cup last year in Pittsburgh, nearly all the fans stayed to watch the ceremony and parade the cup (as well as cheer their thanks to the Pens for their performance.)
Anyhoo, when you watch play in Pittsburgh pr Detroit (and some other cities too, of course, especially the Canadian ones, Boston, etc., you can tell by their reactions that they understand the implications of what seem to be ordinary plays.
Date: Tue Jun 9 18:35:25 2009
User: FilthyMcNasty
Message:Vancouver, Montreal, Edmonton, Calgary. These fans know their hockey.
Date: Tue Jun 9 19:25:50 2009
User: GoodOlMike
Message:You forgot Toronto, home of the Hall of Fame
Date: Tue Jun 9 20:59:48 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:Awesome, exciting first period! The Pens are pouring on the pressure, but Osgood is taking away the angles. And his defensemen are helping. What disappoints me so far is that the Pens aren't getting guys in position to screen Osgood, and even more so to be there for the rebounds. Rebounds off Osgood are scooped up right away by any lurking Red Wing.
Shots on goal way to Pittsburgh's side, but the problem is when one team withstands the other team's best barrages, it can have a psychological effect. I just hope the Pens can keep the pressure on. If they do, some pucks have to go in.
First intermission.
Date: Tue Jun 9 23:08:33 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:That was one intense game. Pens won 2-1. Rushes in both directions, hard-fought. Everything a hockey fan could want. So, now it heads off to be played in front of 20,000+ fans in Detroit. I would say odds are 65-45 Detroit.
One thing that bothered me was the Red Wings got to more loose pucks, and played more effectively in defense of their own goal. Also, they were more aggressive behind the Pens goal.
But the Pens kept the tempo up. Wow.
Date: Tue Jun 9 23:11:23 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:Whhooops! 64-45 is 110% (which is the effort a lot of people claim they give!)
65-35 is what I meant.
.eyeroll
.blush
Date: Tue Jun 9 23:31:11 2009
User: BuzzClik
Message:I actually watched some of the game -- probably about 20 game minutes in all three periods.
In the time I was watching (and I saw all three goals), Detroit outplayed the Pens, but the Pens made all the right plays at the right time.
It could go either way in the final game, but I'm tipping it toward Detroit. Maybe ... 55-45.
Date: Wed Jun 10 07:59:54 2009
User: GoodOlMike
Message:Zetterberg makes a beautiful shot with a Penguin all over him and the shot hits the post. If the Hockey Gods had been smiling on the Wings, they would have steered the puck just 1/4 inch to the right and rewarded Zetterberg.
The Wings had some other excellent chances and didn't score. That's life. Now it's a one game series in Detroit. The home ice advantage has held up for the first six games and I'm guessing it will in the 7th.
Date: Wed Jun 10 09:20:49 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:Yep. The post and the bar have helped a lot of goaltenders' stats! (But if it hits the bar or a post and glances in, it's pretty hard to defend.) I believe Crosby had a couple clankers in the first couple games.
Hey! Have you ever seen the movie "Miracle, Alsaka"? I love that movie. A bunch of villagers who play a strong game where hockey has a dominating tradition play tne NHL Champion New York Rangers on their village pond. (Russell Crowe plays a lead role as the town policeman and aging hockey star.)
(While hockey is played all week long on many levels, the "Saturday Game" is played by the elite players, who are selected for the team by the town council, and dismissed when they no longer can play to that high level.) To prepare they "skate the river" for miles and pull dogsleds, as well as develop their skills and play at the elevated level of the Saturday Game.
For those who haven't seen it, I won't tell the outcome of the game against the Rangers.
Date: Wed Jun 10 10:13:50 2009
User: GoodOlMike
Message:I haven't seen the movie but then it probably wasn't rated R or X :-) Hockey in the north country is like football in the south, a big part of life.
Date: Thu Jun 11 22:29:45 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:Just a few fun "facts":
In the three major league sports that have seven-game finals (NBA, MLB and NHL) no visiting team (like the Pens) have won game seven to close out the series in the past 30 years.
The last to do so was in 1979. The Pittsburgh Pirates upset the Orioles in Baltimore ion the road in Game 7.
In this post-game series, the NHL finale is game # 87!
The Red Wings haven't had to play a game seven in the four finals they played during this stretch.
The Pens won their Stanley Cups on the road.
(And this WILL be Game # 87!)
Date: Thu Jun 11 23:04:03 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:I'm looking forward to the Pirates and Penguins serving as bookends to 30 years of visiting teams futility...
Date: Fri Jun 12 07:48:08 2009
User: GoodOlMike
Message:What makes March Madness so much fun to watch is that every game counts. A game 7 is like that. Past results don't really mean much. Home ice advantage helps but a lot of little things can mean as much. I'd hate to be an odds-maker on this one.
Date: Fri Jun 12 08:03:43 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:Frankly, me too. There are so many intangible, coupled with the bounces of the puck. And Detroit's boards could make a real difference. They can put a puck back in front of a net faster than a Winger! I hope Fleury has figured them out! He'd better have.
.sigh
Date: Fri Jun 12 09:54:18 2009
User: CawthraGuy
Message:my buck is on the wings, I'd like to see them make up for their last game 7. It will make Toronto fans MORE annoyed with MLSE, if that is possible!
Date: Fri Jun 12 20:32:17 2009
User: ix
Message:win or lose, when the camera pans the stands, the amount of white is heartening.
Date: Fri Jun 12 20:59:36 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:Amen!
Okay, first period report. Very hard-fought. But I hate to see the Wings carrying the puck in so much more easily than the Pens. The guy taking it in often gets a shot off, too, even though the shot is often off the mark. The wings also seem to skate harder to the puck, and their passes seem sharper, too.
Crosby and Malkin are both working hard both ways, but it could be the third line that makes the difference
Anyway, the Pens are fighting hard and the building doesn't seem to bother them. Also, they are breaking up more passes as the play moves on. But for the time being, for the Pens it appears to be dump it in and fight for it in the Wings net area.
That could work. But Fleury has to remain sharp, and perhaps another defenseman might have to break a foot stopping a goal! Last game, you do what you gotta.
Go Pens! They got their last year. It's your turn.
Date: Fri Jun 12 23:20:57 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:What a fiercely fought match. High-intensity all the way to the closing seconds, when the cross-bar assisted the Pens' goalie. Wow!
I'm 'bout worn out. My wife sat there and couldn't watch periods 2 and 3. She worked on her address book and stuff while the game went on. I couldn't tear my eyes away.
Date: Sat Jun 13 08:07:37 2009
User: GoodOlMike
Message:No joy in mudville... The storyline for game 7 was pretty much the same as game 6. Repeating a championship season is pretty tough but the Wings came as close as you can without accomplishing it.
I've decided that the Hossa story was a smokescreen. He really came to Detroit to spy for Pittsburg :-) You'll notice that he didn't score any goals against Pittsburg... I wonder if the Wings will renew his $7M contract or bring up some minor league talent. I'd say it's time to move up at least 3 minor leaguers who performed very well in the playoffs.
Date: Sat Jun 13 08:21:38 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:Mike, if I recall correctly (too tired now to research it now) when Hossa came to the Pens during last year he had a reputation. He was strong in the regular season, but didn't achieve much in the Playoffs. But then he had a strong Playoffs for Pittsburgh, and his stock rose.
Myself? I don't think I would pay a ton for him. I think he might have cost himself some future money by turning down the big multi-year bucks from several teams, including the Pens. (Bigger offers than the Pens' money, from another team or two were on the table.)
Okay. I found one article, in which Hossa defends his stats in the Playoffs. His arguments shed a different light on it.
Link: Hossa on his pre-2008 Playoff stats
Date: Sat Jun 13 09:25:14 2009
User: Snowguy
Message:Interesting side note. Yesterday a couple hours before the match, I was at Sam's Club picking up a couple items. As I left, I saw a guy in the lot with "Datsyuk 13" on the back of his jersey. He was just getting into the passenger seat of the car. A few of us were about to do some good-natured booing, but some others nearby were grinning broadly. As the car backed out, we saw the driver was a guy (looked like his brother) wearing a Penguins jersey.
AS they finished backing out I pointed and said "Now, THAT's funny!" The two guys just laughed. (I suspect they got a lot of that yesterday.)
Post follow-up